President Trump

Deljikho, I watched that interview, he hated the way christians were being treated. He hated that Muslims and other people but mainly Muslims were beheading Christians simply for saying "I'm a Christian not a Muslim". He said he wouldn't deny a Christian into our country. Never said he wouldn't allow a Muslim in. So again, your misinterpreting what he's saying.

GOOD POINT! @Aarett , I would like to squeeze in a Sean Hannity quote if you don't mind, "I am not willing to sacrifice an American life" (let me stress, this also includes the immigrants that applied for citizenship) for the good of an immigrant, legal or illegal, Muslim or not.

 

Can you cite any terrorists that have attacked our country that originate from those countries?

What about Saudi Arabia who most of the 9/11 hijackers originated from, or Pakistan who housed Osama Bin Laden?

You are right calling it a "Muslim ban" actually defocuses the discussion into moot points. The outstanding fact is that those 7 countries targeted have not produced the threat that is being claimed by that executive order, which is why the courts denied it repeatedly, Trump was not able to offer a shred of evidence supporting his position.

But that isn't fake because there can be an actual discussion of the topic on the merits of the facts. There is very real merit in the counter argument to the "not discriminatory" talking point, as Deljikho has brought up. If I employed 15 people and I fire 5 of them for hailing from 7 Muslim majority countries, I would be found guilty of discrimination with labor laws on the books and be liable civil/criminally.

We're entering very dangerous grounds on how we use these new terms such as "fake news" or "alternative facts" and we cannot give these notions any legitimacy. Fake news is journalism that outright purports false to be true, not simply biased. If we use the standard of bias then every single media organization there is is outright fake news and it simply isn't true. All the claim does is self-admit that you are not intelligent enough to parse through an article and identify what is true and what is false.

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But we're ignoring the very real issue at heart - That is America is not in the shape of doom and gloom that Trump & Co is pushing. The world has never been less violent and safer than it is currently which also goes for America. Despite just coming out of a waning cycle of economy, which capitalism is known for it's up and downs, we've never had more wealth in any point in time. Our country is not under threat from terrorists and it never was - The damage done wasn't even a single drop in a single bucket.

The sad fact is humans in general are pretty crappy - Thus any measures we put in place we're bound to get some bad apples in a bunch and this is not something that is avoidable, the question is, do we change who we are as a people in the name of fear or do we simply accept the world is a dangerous place and continue to do the very thing that directly made our country the best on the planet - Be a country of immigrants.

 

So for you, articles are valid, but for us, we need a video?


EDIT: what did people think of his speech last night?

 

@WeAreNumberUno Again that is not true, you guys have used articles before and that's fine but for Trump to say that I wanted a video of those words coming right out of his mouth.

@Deinen I respect your opinion and I understand your struggle on the (Temporary ban) but I have to ask you a question..

Do you support Obama?

I would like to say that it was NOT A MUSLIM BAN, as a matter of fact there were still Muslims coming in from other countries. No where on his order did he say "stop all Muslims from entering America". Your information is false. As @Aarett said, and as Trump keeps claiming "fake news" as I've already said before. The media made headlines saying "Trumps Muslim ban" 85% of people I guarantee didn't even read a damn thing about it but that's beside the point. You can't call something, something it's not. Now I asked if you support Obama because, for the one hundredth time I have to say "Obama made the list". I will stand on that firmly. Obamas administration marked those 7 countries as the most dangerous countries in the world. Obama said they were a potentially large threat to our country. Trump saw "Dangerous & Threat" so instead of sitting there twiddling his thumbs, he got up and did something about it. Or atleast tried too, they are making it hard for him to do his job. Which his job is not to represent the world but to represent America.

7 nations in Trump travel ban were named by Obama?

Many people loved his speech and speeches @WeAreNumberUno , what about the governors ball. There has never been that many governors at a governors ball before, topping at 46 I believe. Nearly everything Trump said they all agreed within clapping. This shows he cares about America, Americas people and America representatives. Let alone the fact that police offers, the ICE team and many businesses on top of many many many citizens love what Trump had done and what he will do.

 

I already explained the differences between their measures, your point is moot.

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Did you see that Trump will now publish a list of crimes committed by immigrants?

This is something Hitler literally did in Nazi Germany, he literally published a list of crimes committed by Jews.

 

So now we're comparing a guy who wants to help Americans stay safe to Hitler who was trying to kill the Jews.... you sir are false. Bad comparison. I've seen many leftist compare him to Hitler and be shut down.

 

I'm not comparing anyone. What I am saying is that what Trump is talking about doing is literally exactly what Hitler did.

It's not about keeping America safe, it's about portraying some outside group as the real bad guys. It was Communism/Soviet Union before, now it's the Middle East.

 

com·pare
kəmˈper/
verb
gerund or present participle: comparing

1. 1.
   estimate, measure, or note the similarity or dissimilarity between.
   
   "This is something Hitler literally did in Nazi Germany, he literally published a list of crimes committed by Jews."
   
   That's comparing Trump to Hitler.
   
   Experts say Trump-Hitler comparisons are unfounded
   
   I can assure you even experts that study these things on a daily and went to college and traveled around the world and some even living around those times can tell you Trump and Hitler are not alike. The liberals, the democrats and the leftist are trying to scare people by saying "you elected the next Hitler" it's their way of crying because they lost.
   

 

Anyone who has spent any reasonable amount of time studying history can tell that Trump is nothing close to hitler. Such comparisons lie only in minuscule, cherry-picked similarities between the two. This is just another form of character assassination used by people playing identity politics to distract from the real issues our country faces.

 

Ok fine whatever, I'm comparing.

But the bigger issue should be that Trump has now talked about publishing a list of immigrants who commit crimes. This is something Hitler literally did ---- When has it ever been good to do something Hitler has done?

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Nobody has said Trump is like Hitler.

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Trump is talking about publishing a list of crimes commited by immigrants. Hitler did the same thing.

 

THE DEMOCRATS ASKED FOR IT! Honestly, y'all said "The Muslims and Islamic countries post no threat to America" he had those 7 countries banned temporarily and yall said they weren't a threat, he's giving y'all the facts and now y'all are scared that he's gonna prove y'all wrong. Now y'all are upset, he could literally do good and y'all turn it to bad.

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LOL SIR! You keep saying Trump is like Hitler then you get called out on it and then you deny it only to do it again!!! STOP!

 

Hitler also made the german economy thrive and nearly eliminated unemployment. Your point?

 

I also keep repeating this: I'm not a Democrat - Very much a Independant

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We asked for any kind of evidence showing that those 7 countries were a threat to our nation - None was provided.

We asked why not other countries that we do have evidence of being a threat (Saudi Arabia / Pakistan) were not included in this ban - No answer was ever given

You must be pretty thick.....

There is a massive difference in comparing Trump to Hitler, a man who actively tried to wipe a race off the planet, and pointing out actions that are similar. Why would a list like this concern me? Historically these things are done before people enter pretty dark times socially because once you identify an enemy to lay your problems on there is a rather short time before people begin lashing out at this enemy, especially when they are taught that things are really more difficult than they really are.

My point is Hitler wasn't dumb or lucky but that he did things designed to illicit a reaction. What was the reaction that was wanted when publishing such a list? To motivate your society to blame an alien target instead of internal problems for their woes, then people lash out and history looks back and finds it was a rather backwards and brutal section of time.

How is this solicitation of reaction going to help America? How is blaming our perceived lack of jobs, despite having one of the best economies in the entire history of the planet, on illegals going to help? Manufacturing is never coming back due to robotics, coal is dead due to natural gas - not regulations.

What is your point, you'd be ok with America turning into an authoritarian nation so long as the economy is good?

 

My point is that the notion of trump turning america into an authoritarian nation is delusional. Not poorly based, not even a conspiracy. Purely delusional, and only entertained by those who want to believe it.

 

You are acting just like a typical Anti-Trump Democrat that's why I compared you to the Democrats like you compared Trump to Hitler.

You keep saying that there is massive difference between comparing Trump to Hitler yet you keep comparing them.

The answer was given many of times. Why did Obama feel those 7 countries and only those 7 countries were a threat to America? Why did Obama list those 7 countries as the most dangerous countries in the world? Trump took Obamas words and took action. You keep calling it a Muslim ban, but there are Muslims living in Saudi Arabia & Pakistan. This was not a Muslim ban at all. You act like if you would be less mad if he had banned all the Muslim countries? Is that what you want? Him to ban more countries? I don't think that's a problem. Opening up your borders to everyone as @Aarett said perfectly is asking for attacks on our country.

 

I think he absolutely has authoritarian tendencies such as the constant attacks on the media, undermining judges who disagree with him and the way he has been shuffling his administration, like removing two highly qualified people from the National Security Council for Steve Bannon.

I do not think he can, if he wanted to, turn our country into an authoritarian nation; our institutions are too strong and formed to allow such a thing.

The reason there is any comparison is the objective of the actions both took and the implications and consequences of such an action.

Obama identified 7 nations whose vetting process wasn't rigorous enough and he took action which resulted in freezing new Visas, not refugees, current legal visa holders, nor green card holders - All of which Trump's order did.

That being said, Trump was unable to provide the courts any evidence which justifies his notion that those 7 countries pose a risk enough to cut off all travel. Trump was not able to explain why countries in which we do have evidence of being a threat were not included in this list.

I'm not against temporarily freezing new visas in countries which show a factual threat; I'm against freezing all travel with countries that have not / cannot show a factual threat.

 

You do realize that you only gave more questions and not a single asnwer, correct?

Trump has literally never given any proof that they are a threat, aside from saying "Obama made the list!". He didn't even give proof to the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals when they asked for it. He said it's national security, and the courts said that they are priviledged with the authority to confidentially view information about national security.

Aw yes, just what we needed: A president that will take anything at face value without facts to support the premise.

The two points I'd like to see explained are:
1) Why did he ban them without any evidence that they pose an immediate and significant threat.
2) Why did he not ban countries that do have evidence of being a significant threat?

 

Trump is not trying to an Authoritarian country. He's giving Americans their right to live in a safe country. You can't tell me if Obama claims that those 7 countries are the 7 most dangerous countries in the world that Trump shouldn't try and find out why? Syrias civil war can pose a threat to America.

@Deljikho I answered your question with questions. Within my questions stated facts and if you also read what I posted a while back you'd know the answer.

Again, Trump is nothing like Hitler and that comparison is not a very intelligiant one.

 

Well it took 24 pages, but it finally descended into name calling.

 

No @WeAreNumberUno that's not at all "name calling" all I'm saying is that anything Trump does that is good, they turn into bad. Stop trying to pick and pick at everything I say just to get me blocked.

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It was an analogy, he compared Trump to Hitler I compared him to the Anti-Trump Democrats.