Capture the Flag . . . or Not

Recently, I've been playing a lot of ctf. It's a lot of fun when you get huge teams and the team's are balanced, and the plugin is pretty big free. However, there's a huge number of things that need to be rebalanced. So let's get into it.

• Maps

1. Campers Canyon

This map is a big hole in the ground made by 0zblok. It looks amazing, and I really have to give him credit for making it so well. However, it is one of the most unbalanced maps we have right now. Literally 1 archer can hold off hordes of enemies. There's only one way up to the Flag, so you just get shot over and over to the point nobody can get it. The wheat fields look appealing, but virtually any serious PvPer will tell you farmland is one of the worst blocks you can use for a map. Anticheat plugins are insanely glitchy when you're moving on them, and the wheat means you're hitting the grass more than the enemy when you're using melee.

To make it more balanced, I suggest adding several caves that come from the wheat fields that allow you to go all the way up to the top level. Also, add an entrance into the Flag chamber from the other side, and make both of those two blocks wide. Finally, change the wheat field to one of small flowers with a few trees here and there.
2. Archer Alley
This map, made by MiniArch, is easily the most balanced map we have right now. The icy terrain came out well, and combat is nice. There's plenty of cover from the archers thanks to the ice spikes and houses. The only change I'd make is extending the caves you spawn in so another entrance let's you exit from the side, so people can't spawn camp you.
3. Tag Team Temple
Credits to Alexbear on this Aztec or Mayan temples. The biggest thing on this map is getting up to the Flag is near impossible. Changing out the ladders for slabs was a huuuge improvement, but it's not quite there yet. There's already 1 cave running under the middle, but there is no way to get out from the red side, meaning blue team can't really use it.

To resolve the issues on this map, I suggest adding an additional two sets of stairs to each temple from the sides that goes all the way down to the foundation on which the temple sits. This will allow for much smoother gameplay on this map because it's faster than the slabs, and gives you room to dodge arrows from archers on the top. Finishing the cave will allow both teams to actually be able to use it.

4. Sniper Gulch
The western map(no idea who made it, so thanks arch team, I guess), this is pretty balanced overall, but also needs changes for gameplay. The saloons need alternate entrances because builders can completely block the door. The hills throughout the map could also be raised so that archers can't snipe cross-map. Other than that, nothing is really needed for it.

• Kits

Alright, so, this is probably the biggest thing holding Ctf back from being the absolute best. Let's be honest, archer is overpowered. Literally everyone who can afford it uses it (except @Epixaid, credit to you for using builder!). However, I don't think we should need it. Instead, let's buff the other kits.

Firstly, there's knight. Knight is basically target practice for archers right now. I'd suggest giving Knight I an iron chestplate to start with. Now, before I get yelled at for making knight too overpowered, let me finish. Instead of a later level of knight getting that chestplate, they receive higher levels of protection (possibly sharp, too) as they rank up. However, at Knight I, the chestplate is also enchanted with projectile protection II. So lvl I knight has leather boots and pants, iron sword, and iron chestplate with proj port II. Rank II knight gets protection I on their leather pieces, and sharp I sword. Lvl III knight gets iron leggings and gains sharp II. Lvl IV knight gets the upgraded armor to solid iron all enchanted with protection II on legs and boots, and still the same chestplate. Finally, knight V gets a sharp III sword and protection III on boots.

Archer: leave the same

Scout: instead of a potion, give it a permanent speed effect and weak armor.

Builder: Leave the same except swap the iron axe out for a stone sword.

Demolitionist: Honestly, there just isn't that much use for this kit. Leave the armor and all as it is right now, but give it a stone axe and iron pick so it can break builder placements. Remove the TNT the way the TNT works on this kit, and instead give it a more bazooka feel by having a bow that shoots fireballs (with a 30-1m cool down between shots so it can't get abused) or arrows that explode on impact (also with cool down).


Don't get me wrong, I love ctf and the amount of development that's gone into it. I really hope we can keep making changes and improving it to make it more fun for everyone.

 

Agreed! I play loads of ctf too, and I appreciate all the work you put into this thread. The slabs were placed because the ladders kept on breaking, but I'm happy they balanced things out a little. Also, would you mine elaborating where one of the caves are blocked off or where the problem lies? I was pretty sure players could get through.

I would be happy to talk more in detail about how you think the maps could be balanced. If you'd like, we can start a convo. @MasterofBoom

 

I don't play minecraft anymore but I like your suggestions

We should change the Demolitionist kit to Adrian Kit btw

 

I don't want to make an entirely new thread on this, so I'll just add to this relevant thread:
(Also, I understand that most of these issues are already known -- I would just like to restate them so that most of them can be found on one post)

-Remove extra permission from the lobby. This can cause people to abuse commands like /disguise to gain an advantage in a game. I haven't really tried to look further upon this yet, so I do not know entirely what other commands can be abused.

-Add a time limit for capturing flags. It's possible for someone to take their own flag, then /suicide in a hard-to-get-place. I propose that a time limit be added, so that any flag left on the ground for a particular amount of time (maybe 30 seconds?) will be returned to the owner's base. Additionally, the time limit should also be applied to any player that is attempting to cheat by holding the flag, then hiding in a similar spot.

-Revise the way flags are dropped. Another issue with the flags is that people are able to abuse them by taking advantage of the fact that: a) they drop a bedrock block underneath the location they were dropped at, and b) the flag will still be in the same place the next time the map is played, and can never be removed. This allows players to strategically place bedrock blocks to get into impossible places. or block paths to their own flag so that the enemy team will have trouble. There should be a system that would either remove any existing flags each time the game ends, or change the way flags are dropped, such as an item.

-Make flags harder to steal. It's very easy to steal the flag in maps such as "Campers Canyon" and "Sniper Gulch", since any player can simply take the flag and jump off the waterfall in the former, or blockglitch and steal the flag from the outside in the latter. There should be a system that would take longer to physically acquire the flag, or add obstacles to get to the flag.

-Make teams more balanced. Currently, red team usually has the advantage as they have the chance to have one surplus player on their team (since auto-balance prioritizes putting a player on the red team first). This should be slightly edited so that the priority would be randomized each game, or players can queue to join a particular team.

-Add an AFK filter. I have noticed that the old habit of AFKing in CTF is being restarted. Several people would join a game and AFK, knowing that they have a 50% chance of ending up on the winning team. This gives an unfair advantage to the team without the AFK individual, as they have less players to go against. A plug-in similar to the one in Halo should be implemented, so that a player doing so would be kicked within [30 seconds?] of not moving.

-Friendly fire. This is likely the most well-known issue (and is probably already being worked on). Many know that, when using the bow and arrow, it's possible to harm your own teammates. This can be greatly abused by performing tasks such as killing a teammate holding a flag to steal the capture credit from them, or helping the other team by sabotaging your own.

I still do not know too much about how CTF works, as I have been playing for a few days and only have two kits unlocked. As such, I apologize if I left out a key issue here or mistakenly stated a false fact.

 

This is very true - you demonstrated it to me just the other day, hah.

I'm assuming you mean beyond the door and the cave - I haven't really played much with builders, so I'm not sure how much they can build, but it would be nice to have something more to do with the top floor especially - perhaps a set of stairs on the outside?

I don't! I use Knight, but I agree with Archer is way overpowered and honestly makes CTF frustrating to play at the moment.

Please! They already have weak armour which is fine, but it's basically a useless kit right now - you have two minutes of speed and then you're literally in a kit with worse armour and weapons than Knight but no benefit.

All in all +1. This seems like it'd greatly improve and balance CTF.

+1, 30 seconds sounds good.

To me it seems like this is only an issue on certain maps - in fact, if I remember correctly the last time I played it only happened on Camper's Canyon and Tag Team Temple. But it definitely needs to be fixed.

This makes sense to exist, since it's so long and difficult to get the flag in the first place. I don't like the idea of slowing it down even more, especially when it's so easy to camp and defend the flag right now or snipe someone and steal it back.

Again, I don't think it's super easy to get the flag in this one. First of all, the blockglitch problem should be fixed - perhaps move the flag so it's a bit further from the walls? But I don't think adding more barriers will actually solve the issue.

This is definitely a problem. Currently, since there's such small teams, this could mean the difference between a 3v1 and a 2v2 - if 5 people join and then one person leaves one of the teams. I'm really not sure how it can be fairly fixed though.

Honestly this should be a staple in every minigame.

 

We will be using some of these ideas in the re-release of Ctf, accepted!